I personally believe that a walljump feature and a number of these powerups and shaders should be fully excluded from the base engine to leave room for creativity and learning how to do things on one's own. Your engine has improved a lot Hello, but all these extra features and powerups will encourage laziness and the average newbie could care less to look at the code, no matter how well documented, when they have a fully functional game engine in their hands.

[quote="smbmaster99"]I personally believe that a walljump feature and several of these powerups and shaders should be fully excluded from the base engine to leave room for creativity and learning how to do things on one's own. Your engine has improved a lot Hello, but all these extra features and powerups will encourage laziness and the average newbie could care less to look at the code, no matter how well documented, when they have a fully functional game engine in their hands.[/quote] That's something people have already discussed multiple times here.

[quote="SuperArthurBros"]That powerup feels a little useless; if you want to add wall jump, do it as a permanent feature, so others may remove it if they don't want it in the game.[/quote] There is nothing stopping anyone from removing the powerup. [quote="SuperArthurBros"][quote="smbmaster99"]I personally believe that a walljump feature and several of these powerups and shaders should be fully excluded from the base engine to leave room for creativity and learning how to do things on one's own. Your engine has improved a lot Hello, but all these extra features and powerups will encourage laziness and the average newbie could care less to look at the code, no matter how well documented, when they have a fully functional game engine in their hands.[/quote] That's something people have already discussed multiple times here.[/quote] It's also something I disagree with, which is why I will not be removing any of those features. :)

[spoiler]An engine is an engine, not a full game. It's the base which everything is built apon, the levels, powerups, everything. You can't hand the game to the developer. That's like just handing over the Mona Lisa to Leonardo da Vinci, without the face, and just telling him to do only a little bit more work to get it, and he'll plaster it over all the museums. It's like giving Mercedes Benz a brand new 1 million dollar car, and letting them sell it, claiming it's theirs. Let people work to make good games. Encourage productivity, not just making a poorly designed game in 3 seconds, posting it on MFGG. "GAIS! LUK ATE MEE, AYE MAID A GAM!" Furthermore, let me tell you something. I, myself, am a mediocre programmer. I admit that. But do you see me making ANY Hello based games? At all? Granted, I did learn a lot of new tricks from your engines, that I didn't know where possible, but, that's what engines are for. Using the source, taking something away from it, and making a brand new game. Hello, you have a bad reputation on MFGG for making sloppily put together "Hello Clones", where most of them use the same tileset, same graphics and add nothing new to the Mario fangame realm. Instead of handing a game to someone, give them the basics, so they have more freedom. I can't make anything with your engine because it's so poorly documented, and there are so many features you'll have to edit to even make something original that stands out from the rest of the crowd of "Hell-O Clones". Do you want to see some good examples of your engine? Take, for example, Super Mario Bros. Odyssey. (Or whatever it's called, this is all from my memory.) It adds new characters, completely changes the graphics and differentiates itself from other Hello created games. Sure, that's cool and all, but do you know how rare that it is? tl;dr: Stop putting so much powerups into your game. It discourages originality.[/spoiler] Still, you'll just ignore me completely and go on making Hello Engine 7: The Rebirth, or even Hello Engine 3D *shudders* That's fine. But watch the popularity of your engine sink. I still don't even know the difference between 5 and 6, other than more powerups, and "optimization." Like we've been hoping before, I hope that Hello Engine 7 is a turn-around for your coding, and you'll listen to our complaints and make something interesting. To be honest, Hello Engine, or SMB3 Engine, should of stopped at 4. on topic In any case, that filter just looks wrinkly. Increasing the filter just makes it look ugly.

Well to be fair, Hello's engine for GMStudio is actually very well documented. Some of the modifications I've made to it, like the video I posted a ways back with Mit's Mario sprites, were made a lot easier to implement because of the comments and stuff.

[quote="Darky"]that's what engines are for. Using the source, taking something away from it, and making a brand new game.[/quote] I don't know the exact definition of an engine (other than a car engine), but most engines aren't a learning tool on how to make an engines. Engines are mainly made to make games using existing code to save time from reinventing the wheel.

[quote="DarkBlueYoshi"][quote="Darky"]that's what engines are for. Using the source, taking something away from it, and making a brand new game.[/quote] I don't know the exact definition of an engine (other than a car engine), but most engines aren't a learning tool on how to make an engines. Engines are mainly made to make games using existing code to save time from reinventing the wheel.[/quote] Yeah, the point of an engine isn't to teach coding (unless of course, that's precisely what the engine's author wants). Does Gamemaker teach... whatever Gamemaker is made with?

To be honest, I think that clone problem can be solved with using placeholder graphics and a test level made with them. This forces the developer to use different graphics. I also dislike the number of power ups. Why there are so many power ups? Is ninja suit necessary? I don't think. But I like the wall jump mushroom because this adds possibility of adding wall jumping permanently. However a single variable that turns wall jump on or off would be better. But unlike most of people, I like Hello Engine. It has too many features and allows people to make games in 10 minutes but it's still a great engine. I love how Hello commented it.

[quote="Darky"]An engine is an engine, not a full game. It's the base which everything is built apon, the levels, powerups, everything. You can't hand the game to the developer. That's like just handing over the Mona Lisa to Leonardo da Vinci, without the face, and just telling him to do only a little bit more work to get it, and he'll plaster it over all the museums. It's like giving Mercedes Benz a brand new 1 million dollar car, and letting them sell it, claiming it's theirs. Let people work to make good games. Encourage productivity, not just making a poorly designed game in 3 seconds, posting it on MFGG. "GAIS! LUK ATE MEE, AYE MAID A GAM!" [/quote] There is nothing wrong with those examples if the original creator is given credit for their work. [quote="Darky"]Furthermore, let me tell you something. I, myself, am a mediocre programmer. I admit that. But do you see me making ANY Hello based games? At all? Granted, I did learn a lot of new tricks from your engines, that I didn't know where possible, but, that's what engines are for. Using the source, taking something away from it, and making a brand new game. Hello, you have a bad reputation on MFGG for making sloppily put together "Hello Clones", where most of them use the same tileset, same graphics and add nothing new to the Mario fangame realm.[/quote] My newer fangames include plenty of new stuff. [quote="Darky"]Instead of handing a game to someone, give them the basics, so they have more freedom. I can't make anything with your engine because it's so poorly documented, and there are so many features you'll have to edit to even make something original that stands out from the rest of the crowd of "Hell-O Clones".[/quote] My engine is fully commented, and you can remove whatever you want from it if you think there is too much. [quote="Darky"]I still don't even know the difference between 5 and 6, other than more powerups, and "optimization."[/quote] 6 includes fully re-written code which not only adds tons of code comments, but it simplifies a lot of the engine's code to make it easier to add new powerups/enemies/items/etc. It was mostly a code update. [quote="Mors"]To be honest, I think that clone problem can be solved with using placeholder graphics and a test level made with them. This forces the developer to use different graphics.[/quote] If someone wants to make a clone, that is their choice, and there is no reason for me to stop them.

I don't think Hello should be considered responsible for the fact that there are clones made of his engine. The games themselves might be bad, but it's not the engine's fault. It's like blaming the wood supplier for the fact that the carpenter did a bad job.

[quote="Willsaber"]I don't think Hello should be considered responsible for the fact that there are clones made of his engine. The games themselves might be bad, but it's not the engine's fault. It's like blaming the wood supplier for the fact that the carpenter did a bad job.[/quote] Personally, I think he should, precisely because he added so much content. IMO A Mario engine shouldn't really feature much more than Mario with his movement and physics, some items, a Koopa and a Goomba as example enemies, and maybe one or two power-ups. An engine that already comes packaged with dozens of different enemies, 80% of the series' powerups, every gimmick you could possibly want and even a bunch of bosses isn't exactly encouraging the developer to do..anything. At all. Except for design some levels, which are usually really samey because the tileset it comes with features practically every tile in SMB3, and actually MAKING new stuff is, you know, totally effort, man.

Don't waste your time, Hello never really responds with well thought out answers, just quick 1 sentence "I can do what I want" answers. [s]the analogies are real[/s] What's the point of having a test, if the teacher lets you look at the answers?(Hello being the teacher and the student being the aspiring fan developer) because totally everyone creating hello games are [color=red]2[/color][color=blue]cool[/color][color=red]4[/color][color=yellow]school[/color] and can't actually work for their lives (this isn't sarcasm) To willsaber, you take away at least something from the engine to use in future projects. And I'm specifically talking about the Hello Engine, not Game Maker itself. wake me when Unity Hello Engine 3D is out, horrible code magnified in C# and Java, and also now in 3D and uses Super Mario 64 graphics all the time (edit central)

I know it's hard to let go of the years of work put into Hello Engine, but it needs to go. Yes, it's commented. Yes, it's somewhat formatted properly, but the way the engine is designed is not flexible enough for other users to easily make their games unique without having issues with it. For instance, Mario's code has some hardcoded if statements for the many powerups in the step event. Adding and removing powerups in Mario is hard because of that. It also seems like you're not taking advantage of the new GM features (I haven't used it in years, but I just Googled it). Instead of using global variables, you could use the new enums instead. Or even better: use inheritance for powerup abilities. I'm only scratching the surface of the possible ways to process powerups better than how you're doing it. Also, use the minimal amount of if-statements and loops; [s]branching and looping every frame is slow.[/s] This example only touches the tip of the iceberg of how you can improve you're engine. I suggest you read the GM:S reference; you can improve your code quality by going there. Also, it's easier to start from scratch if you rewrite your engine for better code quality.

Hello does all this work to improve his engine and you just gripe at him. Oh, and he made the engine. That's the definition of "I can do what I want"! Think about this: maybe Hello doesn't MIND people having an easy time of people making a rather complicated game! You guys also act as if a Hello Clone can get popular any more. As of late everyone who DOES use an engine is all "I used an engine BUT I EDITED IT A LOT", so it's not like people are getting famous for ripoffs. If you guys are ungrateful for this engine gladly leave Hello out of it. Sure, Hello has practically packaged a game in this engine but as you should know games take a lot of work. When did it become acceptable to put down someone's work when it's open source? Why, the people who made lots of clones on Yoyogames way back when with the old engines enjoyed it way more than I bet you will for years to come.

I can respect Hello for what he does but I have a hard time finding enjoyment in a Hello-powered game

[quote="DarkBlueYoshi"]I know it's hard to let go of the years of work put into Hello Engine, but it needs to go. Yes, it's commented. Yes, it's somewhat formatted properly, but the way the engine is designed is not flexible enough for other users to easily make their games unique without having issues with it. For instance, Mario's code has some hardcoded if statements for the many powerups in the step event. Adding and removing powerups in Mario is hard because of that. It also seems like you're not taking advantage of the new GM features (I haven't used it in years, but I just Googled it). Instead of using global variables, you could use the new enums instead. Or even better: use inheritance for powerup abilities. I'm only scratching the surface of the possible ways to process powerups better than how you're doing it. Also, use the minimal amount of if-statements and loops; branching and looping every frame is slow. This example only touches the tip of the iceberg of how you can improve you're engine. I suggest you read the GM:S reference; you can improve your code quality by going there. Also, it's easier to start from scratch if you rewrite your engine for better code quality.[/quote] Adding powerups is not hard at all. Most of it is just adding your new sprites and powerup objects to a bunch of switch statements, and then maybe a few minor changes to obj_mario depending on what the powerup does. There is no good reason to use enums over globals, and inheritance for powerups would just make things messy. (Inheritance is already used where it makes sense, like with enemies, holdable stuff, etc.) And you say if statements are slow, but the engine can easily run at hundreds of fps on my 5 year old laptop...

Key word "a bunch" Sure, games DO take a lot of work, but is all that work necessary? If you post a damn engine on a forum made for criticism, you should expect criticism. Still Hello refusing to make any changes to his work... Also, Hello, not everyone has the same PC as yours. It's called optimization. Why write a 13 line code when you can write only 2? Think common sense.

DBY are you talking about branch misprediction? If so, if-statements aren't slow. Branch [i]misprediction[/i] is slow.. I also don't understand why you think looping is slow too... I know you did research on cache, so you should know that looping over large amounts of contiguous data is pretty fast. ~But I have no clue how GM compiles it's code, so I'm not even sure if cache optimization is practical in GM. [quote="Darky"] What's the point of having a test, if the teacher lets you look at the answers?(Hello being the teacher and the student being the aspiring fan developer) [/quote] The answer is relative to who you ask. If you ask an aspiring developer who want to [i]understand how things work[/i], the answers are meaningless. But, that doesn't make the test meaningless. For him, the test is to check if he has attained the understanding he was aiming for. To know that, he must know [i]how[/i] to solve the problem - not the final answer. This person is able to solve problems and fulfill his potential. Give him Hello Engine and he'll probably do something amazing -or use what he's learned to make his own game + engine =p. If you ask a lazy developer who could care less and just want the answers....then yeah the test is meaningless. After this test, he's still where he was at the start of the semester. He doesn't know how to solve any problem that arises and will always be asking the wrong question, "what's the answer", instead of "how do I go about solving this problem"? He's helpless. Give him Hello Engine and he won't be able to do much with it, nor would he be able to make his own game + engine. For fun, if you ask the teacher... The teacher doesn't care for the answer, because he knows the answer. But, he wants to see if you can figure it out too =p. That being said, the usefulness of an engine depends on the users goals. If all they wanna do is make a game, then so be it. Who is Hello to say otherwise? If they wanna learn, then they can too. It makes no sense to impose these goals onto people, and it doesn't make sense to impose such a thing on Hello onto others. ____ [quote="Darky"] If you post a damn engine on a forum made for criticism, you should expect criticism. Still Hello refusing to make any changes to his work... [/quote] Criticism is meant to be considered, not blindly accepted. What if you're [i]wrong[/i]?

[quote="Darky"]Key word "a bunch" Sure, games DO take a lot of work, but is all that work necessary? If you post a damn engine on a forum made for criticism, you should expect criticism. Still Hello refusing to make any changes to his work... Also, Hello, not everyone has the same PC as yours. It's called optimization. Why write a 13 line code when you can write only 2? Think common sense.[/quote] Criticism on my engine's code from people who don't even look at my engine's code is worthless.

It's been so long but nothing has changed, nobody is forcing you guys to use this Engine. If there are too many features then remove some, if you want more features then add them yourself. These silly complaints about graphics and level designs are a waste of time, how is this Hello's fault? If the users don't use this the right way that's their fault. Everyone knows there are better ways to do some if not most of the coding in this Engine but sitting there and pointing fingers acting almighty won't help. I remember downloading the last engine he made for GM6 and it took me no more than 10 mins to add the Wall Jump feature (Before he added it) and JoyPad support. If people would stop using this as a ""Create Your Game" or "Create Your Level" and learn from it, it'll be great. I mean take the best of it and improve it, not just copy it.