Will the new site update be one large update or many smaller incremental updates? Seeing as how it's been in dev for over a year, I'd think it's the former. But is there any chance to try out our changes earlier through smaller but more frequent updates? Of course if any ideas don't mesh well with the community, it should also be easier to remove or change and experiment with further. This way, the community would feel a bit more involved in the mainsite changes when they see their ideas implemented in a relatively short time.

I've always fucking hated the mindset that using swearing is inherently worse than not using it, and man Kritter you are doing absolutely nothing to change that. You're acting so holier than thou because you choose not to use words that don't hurt anyone and are acting like anyone who does is some kinda barbarian who doesn't know the "proper" way to converse. The point of communication is to get across ideas and feelings in the clearest way possible, and swearing is one of the most versatile tools in our language to do that for those who choose to use it. It may not be "formal" but we're not a fucking courtroom here, and if you're trying to say that because i have the audacity to say certain words that a bunch of people who were trying to demonize the lower class decided were "bad" that I'm a "bad communicator", well fuck that. The only thing that's making me a bad communicator in this situation is the fact I can't say what I wanna say without it being filtered to fuck

[quote="MoneyMan"]I've always ****ing hated the mindset that using swearing is inherently worse than not using it, and man Kritter you are doing absolutely nothing to change that. You're acting so holier than thou because you choose not to use words that don't hurt anyone and are acting like anyone who does is some kinda barbarian who doesn't know the "proper" way to converse. The point of communication is to get across ideas and feelings in the clearest way possible, and swearing is one of the most versatile tools in our language to do that for those who choose to use it. It may not be "formal" but we're not a ****ing courtroom here, and if you're trying to say that because i have the audacity to say certain words that a bunch of people who were trying to demonize the lower class decided were "bad" that I'm a "bad communicator", well GORILLA!!! that. The only thing that's making me a bad communicator in this situation is the fact I can't say what I wanna say without it being filtered to GORILLA!!![/quote] This. Also, I don't recall MFGG damaging children on IPB when they allowed for a toggleable swear filter.

[quote="MoneyMan"]I've always ****ing hated the mindset that using swearing is inherently worse than not using it, and man Kritter you are doing absolutely nothing to change that. You're acting so holier than thou because you choose not to use words that don't hurt anyone and are acting like anyone who does is some kinda barbarian who doesn't know the "proper" way to converse. The point of communication is to get across ideas and feelings in the clearest way possible, and swearing is one of the most versatile tools in our language to do that for those who choose to use it. It may not be "formal" but we're not a ****ing courtroom here, and if you're trying to say that because i have the audacity to say certain words that a bunch of people who were trying to demonize the lower class decided were "bad" that I'm a "bad communicator", well GORILLA!!! that. The only thing that's making me a bad communicator in this situation is the fact I can't say what I wanna say without it being filtered to GORILLA!!![/quote] I've never had difficulty saying what I want without swearing.

i would argue further in favor of some kind of swear filter but it'd be like talking to a brick wall at this point.

It's not about whether you use swearing to communicate or not anyway, it's about whether this is the right community to do so.

i think if used in moderation, then it's fine. just because one or people don't like seeing swears at all doesn't mean that nobody should be allowed to use them even within a set of rules. if they're used as scarcely as they are now then why does it matter if it can be toggled? just make a rule where excessive swearing without reason is considered spamming and is a warnable offense. problem solved.

That's just adding more moderation steps to put a bandaid on the problem that was caused by allowing more swearing in the first place.

it's already basically considered a warnable offense so i really don't see how it's adding any more steps than there already are. right now both of the arguments for and against boil down to "i don't like how it looks" in regards to both how it's censored and to swearing in general. if this is something people want then it should be delivered via a compromise rather than a shut down. not all newbies would be underaged, this is another factor, so it's definitely not something that can simply just be ruled out, especially when most of the issues being proposed weren't an issue on the older board that had a toggle.

No my argument boils down to the fact that allowing swearing openly here will encourage people to swear, plain and simple, and there's absolutely no harm in having a swear filter because nobody has given me a reason to believe otherwise. People want it for themselves, not for the forum.

[quote="Kritter"]No my argument boils down to the fact that allowing swearing openly here will encourage people to swear, plain and simple, and there's absolutely no harm in having a swear filter because nobody has given me a reason to believe otherwise. People want it for themselves, not for the forum.[/quote] i've literally never once disagreed with that point and i don't think anyone wants there to not be a swear filter. people obviously want it for themselves to make their own forum-going experience to be more comfortable, that's the point. you don't need to use it if you don't want to. the filter wouldn't disappear or leave but it would be there as an option for those who want it off. you're not going to get a reason to believe otherwise because there's no reason for you to turn it off. it's just an option for people who want it. if it ends up encouraging swearing when put into action then we make a compromise or tweak it.

I think it's time to settle the swear filter thing, at least for now. Mit's user filter idea is really cool. Obviously I'm in favor of a togglable swear filter, but that position doesn't appear to be the most popular, which is fine. I wasn't even really trying to argue that there SHOULD be one, just more than I didn't agree with Kritter's logic. But it's not even that big a deal if I don't see eye-to-eye with him; an argument shouldn't have happened. [b]Final word for now:[/b] we'll consider our options and try to find one, if there is one, that will best let users exercise their autonomy while filtering words we'd like to keep in moderation on MFGG. [quote="[url=http://phpbb.mfgg.net/viewtopic.php?p=501703#p501703]TheShyGuy[/url]"]Will the new site update be one large update or many smaller incremental updates? Seeing as how it's been in dev for over a year, I'd think it's the former. But is there any chance to try out our changes earlier through smaller but more frequent updates? Of course if any ideas don't mesh well with the community, it should also be easier to remove or change and experiment with further. This way, the community would feel a bit more involved in the mainsite changes when they see their ideas implemented in a relatively short time.[/quote] One big update; the reason being because it's going to use almost entirely new software (we're only keeping the mainsite database; everything else must go). Though you raise a good point. Cap'n Coconuts has mentioned before that there should be a test site somewhere, which I will likely upload onto my webspace for trying out. I've got a basic preview [url=http://hyliandev.byethost7.com/mfgg3/]of the MFGG3 template[/url] which can be seen there now. [b]EDIT:[/b] Oh and here's some new ideas to consider: [list] [*] Badges give you notifications [*] Achievements that also give you notifications; "Your 500th post! Your post got 50 likes!" etc[/list]

On the subject of post likes, I'm sure it's been mentioned but it'd be nice if there were a way to let someone know their post was helpful. Kind of how Facebook has multiple "like" types, it'd be good for people to know they've helped someone. I think that'd be a good way to encourage being helpful when people are asking for assistance with fangames (or other things), and could tie in with a new form of the Big Help badge.

[font=Comic Sans MS]I suggest that we set up a suggestions board sooner than later because this thread is hard to follow with all the different ideas going on at the same time! I think if we remove a mandatory swear filter then the only way to discourage swearing is with the rules and enforcing them, and I think that's a pretty bad solution, both for the members and the moderators who have the misfortune of having to enforce something like that.[/font]

I'd want to see badges that act more like achievements. Like getting a new badge for each 1000 posts, or a post getting 100 likes, or collecting total 100 Tusk Bucks etc... Maybe some kind of oldbie badge would work too, like for those who are MFGGers for over 10 years. I'd also want to see some badges go, such as Top 5 badges. It takes no effort to get these badges and I can see people not putting much effort into their entries just to get a new badge. I also don't like the Happy Heart badge. It pretty much awards you for being inactive, since if you're active, you have a higher chance of getting warned even if you did nothing wrong (you know that happened to several users before). I'd also get rid of some outdated badges like Good Citizen, or start using them again, but that's hardly a problem. Oh BTW, I'm also part of some other forums that allow swearing, and guess what? No one swears enough to be a terrible influence for children. I know we are done with this topic, but man, can't you guys stop being too paranoid about people swearing here? It's not the end of the would, and it definitely won't be a big influence for 11 year olds who visit here. This is the internet, they've seen someone swearing before. Plus, if someone always talks like "****ing Nintendo, when will these *******s release **********ing Mother 3? **** you Nintendo, I ****ing hate ***** ****** ************ing walrus *****************." you can just warn them.

[font=Comic Sans MS]We can all vaguely agree when swearing becomes excessive, but no matter what we decide the specific rule to be, there's always going to be people soured about it. It's really not a simple problem of making the right rule. The only fair rule would be to ban them entirely, and no one wants that. Badges additionally working as achievements could be fun, but we'd want to make the contributor badges more significant I think.[/font]

i was actually thinking that people who (regularly?) make lengthy and useful tutorials and resources (which i'd assume would be the focus of the new board) would get a new user title related to their field. i dunno if this would give them any kind of special privileges though, that would potentially be linked with any new forums we'd need.

[quote="Mors"]I'd want to see badges that act more like achievements. Like getting a new badge for each 1000 posts, or a post getting 100 likes, or collecting total 100 Tusk Bucks etc... Maybe some kind of oldbie badge would work too, like for those who are MFGGers for over 10 years. I'd also want to see some badges go, such as Top 5 badges. It takes no effort to get these badges and I can see people not putting much effort into their entries just to get a new badge. I also don't like the Happy Heart badge. It pretty much awards you for being inactive, since if you're active, you have a higher chance of getting warned even if you did nothing wrong (you know that happened to several users before). I'd also get rid of some outdated badges like Good Citizen, or start using them again, but that's hardly a problem. Oh BTW, I'm also part of some other forums that allow swearing, and guess what? No one swears enough to be a terrible influence for children. I know we are done with this topic, but man, can't you guys stop being too paranoid about people swearing here? It's not the end of the would, and it definitely won't be a big influence for 11 year olds who visit here. This is the internet, they've seen someone swearing before. Plus, if someone always talks like "****ing Nintendo, when will these *******s release **********ing Mother 3? **** you Nintendo, I ****ing hate ***** ****** ************ing walrus *****************." you can just warn them.[/quote] The top 5 badge is basically for participation, it shows that someone at least entered a competition and engaged with the community. It had more purpose back when competitions got more entries to be honest. It really shouldn't be awarded when there's not enough entries altogether. Post count achievement badge I don't have a problem with, it could upgrade over time as the post count increases. Post counts aren't really something to care too much about but it's incentive at least to engage with the community. Happy Heart badge has a place but it doesn't really work. Perhaps there should be some kind of "logged-in" timer but I don't know how that works. It was meant as a reward for good behaviour over time. I'd like to see it replaced with another system like I mentioned before, if someone gets a lot of likes or something like that, they get a badge for the type of like they got. "Good contributor" / "helpful contributor" / "funny contributor" etc but that's just brainstorming. "It's not the end of the world" isn't a good enough argument to remove the swear filter because the same argument could be had for keeping it. Can't see swearing? What's the harm, it's not the end of the world.

Okay, it seems like this swear filter argument won't go anywhere lol. At this point, I think it's best to leave this to the staff. [quote="Mit"]i was actually thinking that people who (regularly?) make lengthy and useful tutorials and resources (which i'd assume would be the focus of the new board) would get a new user title related to their field. i dunno if this would give them any kind of special privileges though, that would potentially be linked with any new forums we'd need.[/quote]I'm kind of against this idea, because I'm pretty sure this would end up with them being treated as a site staff by some people. I think a special badge would work better for something like this.

that would be the point, though. to an extent. the idea of having that kind of title would be that they would be okay with having newbies coming to them directly for help. if there's someone to go to regarding a question you have, just go to them and they'll help you out. it'd probably be a voluntary thing on top of a "legacy" thing, you need to prove you're capable of doing it and you could maybe even get voted in. this being said, i dunno if in-forum instant messaging was brought up to replace PMs, but we should definitely do that if this kind of thing happens, because i can't see it not getting annoying getting PMs constantly. IMs are much more manageable.